Ohio State University WAS on probation until March 2009
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 5, 2011 3:21 PM PDT
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PrintNow, I realize that the NCAA has already deemed judgement on the discounted tattoo's that Pryor, Herron, Posey, Thomas and Whiting received- in which case, the NCAA helped to make tOSU's situation an "eligibility" issue. Read: not a "non-compliance" issue. As we all know, the NCAA categorically reinstated those players so that they could play in their Sugar Bowl win over Arkansas, but "punished" them by making them ineligible for the first 5 games of this upcoming season. This is where things get weird. . .
. . . .because, it doesn't take much to find out that TattooGate took place towards the end of the 2008/'09 season and the early part of the 2009/'10 college football season. This would put tOSU right smack dab in the third and final year of the 3-year probationary period stemming from penalties arising from OSU basketball player, Boban Savovic's infractions case of receiving improper benefits under ex-Coach Jim O'Brien's tenure.
To some, including the NCAA- the Tattoo 5 thing might be water under the bridge- meaning, the NCAA might NOT elect to revisit the actual infractions committed by those players who received discounted tattoos and sold off team equipment as part of memorabilia items that they profited from. But even still, in light of Coach Jim Tresel's new allegations surrounding non-compliance rules violations regarding the same 5 players- and the fact that his acts, as well as the players took place during a time that OSU was on probation- shouldn't the Ohio State University be looking at Lack of Institutional Control charges right about now? In the least, they should be facing Failure to Monitor charges.
They had players receiving improper benefits (they just weren't properly educated, right?) and a head coach who knowing lied to the NCAA (report) and school administrators (totally non-compliant related issues) and Ohio State has self-reported numerous secondary violations in recent years.
I don't dislike the Buckeyes in any way, shape or form, but if the NCAA doesn't delve into the deeper issues surrounding their athletic program- then they should have no authority running college athletic rules and compliance enforcement WHATSOEVER!
[edit] Here is a late-entry link to this post regarding the Tattoo 5 scandal that rocked tOSU late last year. I'll highlight two parts of it:
"Pryor and four teammates were suspended Thursday by the NCAA for the first five games of next season for selling championship rings, jerseys and awards. They also received improper benefits – from up to two years ago – from the tattoo parlor and its owner." -1
"'These are significant penalties based on findings and information provided by the university,' Kevin Lennon, NCAA vice president of academic and membership affairs, said in a statement.
Lennon said a game was added to the usual four-game penalty because the players did not "immediately disclose the violations when presented with the appropriate rules education."
There are seven full-time staffers and two interns in Ohio State's compliance department. [OSU A.D. Gene] Smith said they were complicit in the violations because they didn't make it "explicit" to players they weren't permitted to receive such benefits." -2
[second edit] On the NCAA.org page, go to FAQ sidebar and highlight the pertinent listing under LOIC/FTM- I found this gem. It should, but won't apply to ex-Coach Jim Tressel:
Can individuals be charged with a lack of institutional control or failure to monitor?
Yes. Coaches and staff members can be held personally responsible for failing to adequately monitor and exercise appropriate control over rules compliance in an athletics department or within a sport program. NCAA bylaws require head coaches to promote an atmosphere for compliance and to monitor the rules compliance of those who report to them. (straight from the website)
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Conquest Chronicles' writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Conquest Chronicles' writers or editors.
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Bix...you make too much sense
This isn’t about NCAA rules, regs, or violations. Not even violations on probation. It’s more about “the Gee/Emmert conection”:
http://www.conquestchronicles.com/2011/6/25/2243634/the-gee-emmert-connection
It’s about an organization that uses it’s power to tilt the playing field in favor of its inner circle. The powers that be don’t want tOSU punished…even for one bowl game! This whole episode will be hung Tressell. and the NCAA wil mange to confirm exactly zero other violations at tOSU. A slap on the wrist is coming, and it won’t matter that tOSU had a HC covering up violations invovling numerous of his highest profile athletes DURING A PERIOD OF PROBATION. The NCAA has a big rug, and that’s were this is headed.
Thanks JAG!
I appreciate your kind words.
On the Columbus Dispatch article from above (“Ohio State has self-reported. . . .” link), there’s a sidebar with numerous titles: read the one on “Violations”. It’s crazy. It’s not just the Tattoo 5 and Coach Tressel stuff. THERE’S MORE.
Now I’m not sure if those are all considered “secondary violations”, but I’ll tell you this much: IF THAT SHIT EVER HAPPENED AT USC. . . . . the NCAA would have closed our shop down long, long ago.
I will go on record as stating: USC is held to a HIGHER STANDARD of rules compliance than any other program in the country. We have the Death Penalty punishment as our more recent validation of that statement.
The Death Penalty for not having enough people in Athletic Compliance. We should have known. High-profile athlete’s require high profile compliance. . . . .yeah, that kinda sh_t!
(they couldn’t beat us on the field. and when they beat us administratively, THEY HAD TO CHEAT to do it!)
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 5, 2011 8:07 PM PDT up reply actions
F**K Em All!
It will never change, West of the Rockies does not exist, the ‘Good ’ol Boys Club’ ends there.
Oh, Mama, can this really be the end
To be stuck inside of Mobile
With the Memphis blues again
-R. Zimmerman
And the cavalier-attitude taken by their AD Gene Smith?
We know what Mike Garrett said after the NCAA sanctioned us, but did you read the HuffPost link, “As Smith and Tressel left Thursday’s news conference, Smith tried to lighten the mood. ‘We might,’ he said with a smile, ‘hire a tattoo person and put them in the Woody Hayes (Athletic Center).’”
It’s like, this is what I’d love to say to Gene Smith at tOSU: "Dude! You’re so damn lucky the NCAA hasn’t lit up your program like a 4th of July-fireworks show. STFU, already! Tattoo parlor? Try getting “live humans” in you Compliance Dept, bro. Someone with a credential in something. To actually teach rules of compliance, maybe?"
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 5, 2011 10:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Pat Haden's strategy
now has to be to let those guys have all the rope they need so the media can hang them. Anyway, you don’t need luck when the NCAA fix is in.
Nice work Bix!
"The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything." - Joseph Stalin
U feeling Loco?
Pat Haden has strategy?
When did he order that? Is that extra?
Naw, I’m just kidding- I like the little f_cker. He might just surprise us all- then again, as I hear people say about Coach Kiffin, “He might just be the man/coach we need AT THIS MOMENT- just not long term.”
As difficult as this sounds, our vengeance in this whole NCAA mess that TrojanNation finds itself in- rests on ex-Coach Todd McNair’s litigation with the NCAA. My deepest hope is that Todd McNair and his lawyers GO FOR THE JUGULAR. That they don’t “settle”, they don’t defer, and they don’t take their foot OFF THEIR FREAKING FACE! I’d love it to see that the NCAA pays out their ass to Todd McNair and that the courts see to it that they are forced to make wholesale changes to their due process rights and procedures for defendants facing committee hearings and enforcement (investigative) testimony.
Coach got robbed of life, liberty, and freedom to make a salary in the professional field of his talents.
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 6, 2011 7:17 AM PDT up reply actions
And then there's this poor m-fer, from UNC
Did you read about his tale of woe?
The NCAA has got some batty son’s a bitches, no? They can’t find justice in a dictionary, which is all well and good. Because when it comes to US jurisdictional courts, I’m sure someone will remind the NCAA lawyers, “This ain’t a court of justice, this is a court of law. And y’all aren’t above it. We’re gonna take a look at your books AND review your style of jurisprudence.”
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 6, 2011 7:46 AM PDT up reply actions
NCAA doesnt care
how they appear. They know that they are getting raked over the coals in the press. I don’t think that they give a rip.
This is true, but they really really don’t want to get their asses dragged in front of congress again. If there’s enough of an outcry it will happen. A lot of that would depend on our vaunted California congressional delegation.
Yes, I still believe in Santa, the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy :-P
"The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything." - Joseph Stalin
U feeling Loco?
Santa and the Tooth Fairy are for real! Wassamattwitchu?
[the Easter Bunny told me so]
I’ll bet Dominique-Strauss believes IN GOD right about now, if he didn’t already. Now that m-fer must’ve sold his soul, in order to be able to leave the US and our District Court’s jurisdiction.
Craziness.
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 6, 2011 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions
I seriously doubt that
anyone is going to cry about USC getting screwed outside of California legislators as you mentioned. I don’t expect harsher penalties to UNC, OSU, and Oregon when you compare their penalties to ours. We got screwed, it won’t change, and everyone else will probably get appropriate penalties in the end.
The NCAA has a choice to be consistent and screw a handful of top programs, or just screw USC. I think they will just screw us.
by frak on Jul 6, 2011 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ding ding ding, we have a winner!
A Quick Note for the Quitters
No comment from this thread will be deleted. You will have to own them when we get it turned around and beat Southern Cal. You will never ride the bandwagon when we come back. Not on BN. GO BRUINS.
by Nestor on Sep 4, 2010 9:24 PM CDT
You were right long ago, and you're 100% correct here too!
That they spend countless dollars on this cockamamie PR campaign, instead of vetting out corruption and streamlining their enforcement and investigative processes is confirmation of this.
PR to whitewash a whitewash. Typical elitist attitude that is loathe to calls for reform.
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 6, 2011 11:03 AM PDT up reply actions
Sheesh! I hate to pile on, but. . . . .
. . . .all I wanted to do was find the NCAA final report on the Tattoo 5 reinstatement.
I found it, and this is just GOLD!
1. These include the acknowledgment the student-athletes did not receive adequate rules education during the time period the violations occurred, Lennon said. [Kevin Lennon, NCAA vice president of academic and membership affairs]
2. "We were not as explicit with our student-athlete education as we should have been in the 2007-08 and 2008-09 academic years regarding the sale of apparel, awards and gifts issued by the athletics department," Smith said. "We began to significantly improve our education in November of 2009 to address these issues. After going through this experience, we will further enhance our education for all our student-athletes as we move forward."
Not that I think I’m some kind of journalistic sleuth or anything, but- what does these revelations have to say about mainstream media coverage of the Tattoo 5 situation? If I could find this stuff in less than 36 hours, what are these people getting paid to do over at Yahoo!, SI, ESPN, & CBS Sports?
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
In regards to #1:
If the Compliance wasn’t doing their job over at OSU, and OSU was on probation at the time of the infractions (‘07/’08 and ‘08/’09 academic/athletic years)- even though this case was a “reinstatement” case- they still involve infractions. Major infractions or not, if an institution is already under penalty of probation at the time of minor/major infractions do not NCAA bylaws state that the school should have been investigated via “Failure To Monitor” notice of allegations by the NCAA?
I mean, in USC’s case- we didn’t have enough staff in Compliance AND THEY HAMMERED US with Lack of Institutional Control. That makes a ton of sense? The NCAA acknowledges that we had an inadequate staff, shouldn’t it be redundant that maybe some of our athletes and their immediate family members weren’t adequately up-to-date on a a few rules of compliance? Yet, OSU has a staff of 7 and were on probation to do better as far as compliance-related matters- and still: they self-report a ton of secondary violations AND 1/8 of their starting football stars are hit with serious violations AND OSU Compliance gets off scott free? Later, THEIR HEAD COACH is found to have lied and . . . . .what? maybe HE TOO wasn’t up to speed?
If that’s not “Failure To Monitor” than I don’t know what it.
It’s beyond failure to monitor coaches and players- it’s a total lack of respect of NCAA compliance as a whole. Gene Smith OWNS THE NCAA!
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 6, 2011 9:16 AM PDT up reply actions
Serious question...
What is the disadvantage of being on PROBATION if when you commit MAJOR violations while on probation the ONLY significant penalty you impose is MORE PROBATION?
Sorry, but tOSU’s self-imposed penalties of: 1. vacate some wins which would certianly be taken away regardless, 2. promise to try harder with compliance, and 3. “more probation” are laughable.
“Probation”, in and of itself, is NOT a penalty. It’s a mitigating factor which should influence the nature and severity of the real penalties. tOSU’s self-imposed “penalties” are insincere, pathetic, desperate.
Great question!
I also read that tOSU wrote something to the affect that they realize they’re “repeat offenders” but steadfastly believe they can/will institute proper changes to compliance procedures and education of athletes which will improve their Compliance Dept.
Shouldn’t they have done that with Savovic? We get a plane ride with Trepagnier- and the NCAA acts like we’ve murdered people with Bush/Mayo.
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
by BixBeiderbecke on Jul 9, 2011 6:42 AM PDT up reply actions
Yep...
In lieu of any real penalties, I guess tOSU simply wants an upgrade to “double secret probation”.
by TrojanJAG on Jul 9, 2011 6:56 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
JAG!
I wrote my reply to you, went and grabbed a bowl of Raisin Bran, came back to Conquest Chronicles, read THIS comment from you and. . . . . .
I’ll be cleaning up after this reply, just to let you know. (i lost it! hurled masticated cereal all over my coffee table, laptop, carpet. Arggggggggggggggggggh! THAT was funny!)
Double secret probation? Shouldn’t their AD be fired right about, . . .say?. . . .NOW! It’s like, “Gee, Gee! Both you and your AD have been derelict for about 5 years now. You both hired a coach that has famously lied and covered-up, your student-athletes have been woefully informed and educated in rules of compliance, and your compliance self-reports a violation practically every 5 days for the past 5 years. Do you REALLY THINK your AD deserves to be in his position any longer. And you? Do YOU believe YOU have been doing a bang up job, considering your job and responsibility to your beloved insitution? How’s that mirror o”f yours Gordon?
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
Where do they say a dead fish stinks from???????
Oh, Mama, can this really be the end
To be stuck inside of Mobile
With the Memphis blues again
-R. Zimmerman
A Horseshoe?
Buckeyes smell like fish, to some people.
If you want to walk the heavenly streets of gold, you gotta know the password, "Roll, tide, roll!"
I agree with all here
But the Ncaa will never care about what they do until someone stands up to the Block Bully and knocks their head off, those planes hit the wrong buildings.
Who--What--Slim Shady----the ncaa is after all the BS they are lying out----and just remember they will rewrite history every seven years after the fact. Tennesse will get off with nothing on the violations, but that really doesn't matter they suck anyway.
by so.cal.native1952 on Jul 10, 2011 9:49 AM PDT reply actions
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