Questions with regards to Reggie's Impala?
Something doesn't add up with regards to Reggie's Impala.
The COI report says one thing but McNair's response says something else entirely...
This is form the COI Page #5
(4) During a telephone conversation in late 2004, student-athlete 1 informed agency partner A that he (student-athlete 1) was embarrassed to drive his current vehicle, a pick-up truck, and wanted a different vehicle. Agency partner A agreed to provide the cash to purchase a vehicle. A short while later, in December 2004, student-athlete 1 located a vehicle he wanted, and agency partner A gave student-athlete 1's stepfather several thousand dollars in cash for a down payment on the vehicle. Student-athlete 1 later contacted agency partner A to request additional money needed to purchase wheel rims for the vehicle. Agency partner A then drove from San Diego to Los Angeles and gave student-athlete 1 an additional several thousand dollars in cash. Approximately one week later, agency partner A gave student-athlete 1 another sizable cash payment, which the student-athlete used for a car alarm and audio system.
This is from McNair's Response Page 8 of the PDF...
(4) During a telephone conversation in February 2005, [Redacted] informed Lake that [Redacted] was embarrassed to drive his truck and needed a different vehicle. Lake agreed to provide the cash to purchase a vehicle. A couple of days later, [Redacted] located a vehicle to purchase, and Lake gave Lamar $13,000 cash. [Redacted] called Lake from the dealership to thank Lake for the money and to request additional money needed to purchase rims for the vehicle. Lake then drove from San Diego to Los Angeles and gave [Redacted] approximately $5,000 cash. Approximately one week later, Lake gave an additional $3,500 in cash, which [Redacted] used to pay for a new alarm and audio system for the vehicle. [Bylaw 1 2 .3 . 1 .2]
So, who is right?
The COI's info is ambiguous in its time line and amounts where in McNair's response the time line and amounts are a little more detailed. This information came from somewhere. McNair's attorney would not make that date up because McNair has nothing to do with the car. The COI references "December 2004" numerous times when discussing the purchase of the vehicle. Yet they offer no concrete proof other than the car registration form filed with the school that states that the car was purchased in Dec. 2004....
Reggie claims he got the money form his parents but they aren't cooperating. Lake and his family can't produce records for even a bank withdrawal.
If the car was purchased in Dec 2004 Reggie would have had to fill the disclosure form prior to starting the spring semester. But if the car was purchased after the semester started in 2005 then that could explain why there's no disclosure form file prior to Aug 2005 as the COI report indicates.
This kind of matters.
If the call about the money for the Impala didn't happen until February 2005 instead of December 2004, like the COI's reports shows. That would then mean that Reggie was eligible for the the UCLA game AND the BCS Title Game. If we are to go by the garbage that Paul Dee set forth that USC was banned from post-season play for TWO bowl games because Bush played in TWO bowl games while ineligible then wouldn't one think if they got the date wrong here that Bush was NOT in fact ineligible?
The COI says one date, December 2004, in the report they released on June 10. Yet McNair's response, dated January 4, 2010, says another date. Considering that the enforcement staff and COI made some serious mistakes in their questioning of McNair WRT the dates of a particular phone call, not to mention their spoon feeding of Lake in his testimony it is entirely possible that they could have screwed this up.
Maybe NCAA Spokesperson Stacey Osburn can explain the discrepancy in the dates...
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Nice comment from the Spokeshole
I thought the NCAA didn’t comment
“The NCAA will not comment on the content of confidential documents. “HOWEVER” bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit……………………………..
How do you feel about the ncaa, gnossos?
No comment!
"Government is the opiate of the masses" Dennis Prager
"I've got blisters on my fingers!!!!!!"
The same ncaa that screwed me and 100,000s of other athlete's over the past 30+ years, hope they all stew in their own hell.
So Fight On USC followers and Don’t worry WE Will Still Play on Saturdays and Bowls will come later, for WE ARE SC not That other Softball University. Oh and don’t say you now have a baseball team, it’s not Real Baseball unless you use Wooden Bats.
by so.cal.native1952 on Jun 27, 2010 10:33 PM PDT reply actions
As we speak the professionals from the Freeh Group
are hard at work dissecting Frankenstein. LINK
Fight On Director Freeh!
Still LOCO after all these years
All hail Augustus Kiffin!
M·AGRIPPA·L·F·COS·TERTIVM·FECIT
Remind me to hire their web designer when I get a company
MAGNIFICENT GRAND CHAMPION CC NCAA BRACKET 2010
This is the issue of Finding 1-a-(4). Before it became Finding 1-a-(4) in the NCAA’s Public Infractions Report (issued 6/10/10), it was presented at the COI meeting (Feb 19-21, 2010) as Allegation 1-a-(4), the product of a 3 ½ year NCAA investigation. Between February and June of 2010, 1-a-(4) was changed profoundly, such that it became the primary justification for stripping USC of its 2004 BCS victory. Without such change, the NCAA COI probably wouldn’t have had grounds to vacate that championship. So, did the NCAA alter the conclusion of its investigative team because new evidence became available between February and June, or did it realize during that period that a change of dates was necessary to justify the NCAA’s predetermined objective of stripping USC of the 2004 BCS title?
The first quote you highlighted (with the date "late 2004") is taken directly from the Public Infractions Report (6/10/10), page 5:
http://vmedia.rivals.com/uploads/995/952139.pdf
The second quote you highlighted (with the date "Feb 2005") is taken directly from USC’s formal response (pages 32 and 33) to the COI, prepared 12/09 and presented Feb 19-12 at the COI meeting:
http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/usc/sports/m-footbl/auto_pdf/USCs2009ResponsetoNCAA.pdf
The format of USC’s response is clear. USC was presented with a series of allegations based on the findings of the NCAA investigation and either agreed with or defended itself against each allegation. The second quote you highlighted (with the date "Feb 2005") is the formal "allegation" based the NCAA investigation. It is evident that the primary source of this allegation must be testimony provided by Lloyd Lake that Reggie Bush asked for the Impala in February 2005. This is in approximate agreement with the Yahoo investigation which determined that Reggie Bush was given the Impala in "Spring 2005".
Also contained within USC’s response is the statement (page 27): "USC agrees that Student athlete 1 (Bush) was ineligible for competition throughout the 2005-6 football season. We have no basis upon which to conclude that Student athlete 1 was ineligible for competition during the 2004-2005 football season." It seems highly likely that the NCAA agreed with this conclusion, and therefore need to change its allegations to justify declaring Bush ineligible for 2004-2005.
There simply must have been too much pressure on the NCAA to take away USC’s 2004 title than to stick with the primary conclusion of their investigation…that Reggie Bush himself (excluding family) didn’t receive any substantive or documented benefits until at least February 2005. In the NCAA’s own words (Public Infractions Report, page 12):
"The question facing the committee was whether student-athlete 1 agreed to become involved with the proposed agency and, if so, when that happened. The committee finds that an agreement for representation was made in the fall of 2004 when student-athlete 1 and his stepfather agreed to form a sports agency with agency partners A and B and that student-athlete 1 began receiving benefits at least by December 2004 when he received funds to purchase an automobile. [See Finding 1-a-(4).] Based on the information presented to the committee, not only was student-athlete 1 aware of and willing to accept assistance from agency partners A and B, but he also agreed to join in that effort."
Since the exact date that Lake, Bush and his stepfather entered an agreement for representation is a point of contention (the NCAA acknowledges that an "operating agreement" was not in place until Jan. 20th, 2005, PIR page 13), the date that Bush began receiving benefits would be strong evidence of a tacit and consensual agreement and on Reggie’s part. Without this, you’ve basically got a couple of guys talking, perhaps negotiating, about forming a sports agency, and the NCAA bylaws specifically prohibit "agreement of representation", not talking. Without Reggie receiving any benefits before the Orange bowl, USC has a very strong case to retain its 2004 BCS title. Problem was, the NCAA investigation (based on Lake’s testimony) and the Yahoo investigation both had Reggie receiving the Impala in Feb 2005, at earliest. This explains why the NCAA’s dates changed (from Feb ’05 to Dec ’04) between February 2010 and June 2010, between Allegation 1-a-(4) and Finding 1-a-(4).
Did the NCAA have any basis to justify a December 2004 date of purchase for the Impala? This answer is "yes". Bush completed a USC Student-Athlete Motor Vehicle Information form in August, 2005 which stated the Impala was purchased "December 2004", and that was the date that the NCAA chose to adopt. However, in doing so, the NCAA determined that Reggie Bush’s recollection (December 2004) was more credible than Lloyd Lake’s recollection (February 2005) for perhaps the one and only instance in the entire case. In doing so, the NCAA adopted a conclusion that was in direct conflict to testimony given by both witnesses, Lake and Bush; namely that Lake had given an Impala to Bush in December 2004. In doing so, the NCAA has set precedent that BCS championships can hinge upon something as seemingly minor as the accuracy by which college kids complete administrative paper work.
It is unfortunate that the NCAA, armed with nothing more than vague recollections from disreputable people with conflicting motives can take down a major university’s athletic program. The USC case is a another example that power corrupts and of what can happen in the absence of any meaningful oversight.
Please write this up as a separate fan post and I will bump it to the main page...great read!
Just curious…what branch JAG?
"Mention USC to a Bruin and they get angry; mention UCLA to a Trojan and they laugh."
I agree, this is front page material
The COI acted on behalf of Eastern interests that ordered them to neuter USC. The deck has been stacked against the Pac-10 so that none of our teams will sniff the BCS Championship Game in the next five years. Remember what they did to Oregon? Where is Larry Scott? Where are Mayor Tony and the rest of the dung beetles that run this city? Our congressional delegatoin? Crickets…
Still LOCO after all these years
All hail Augustus Kiffin!
M·AGRIPPA·L·F·COS·TERTIVM·FECIT

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