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USC Recruiting: The struggles of the 2009 team and the correlation to the recruiting class of 2006

 

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The Stable

 

The obvious struggles of this years team has made a few people take a closer look at the make up of this team. It is easy to point to the loss of all the talent on defense as well as the loss of Mark Sanchez last season but does that tell the whole story? There is a lot of talent on this team and many of those players are from the recruiting class of 2006. The overall expectations and production of the class of 2006 as we now know it has been less than what we have been used to from previous years. The class of 2006 may not be a bust but they haven't been lights out either.

This post is not meant to be inflammatory towards any player currently on the roster or any player who has departed the program for any reason or at any time, good or bad. This post is more a general observation.

So much has been made of Pete Carroll's recruiting prowess that it almost seems automatic that PC will haul in a top 5 class year in and year out. That isn't always the case, but I am more concerned about quality over quantity. Pete Carroll has not over recruited like some programs have but he isn't innocent either (I believe he over recruited by 3 or 4 players in 2003, I could be wrong on the year though).

There is no question that Pete Carroll has stockpiled a ton talent, almost to a fault, but he gets a lot out of his talent...but not always the most. That is what is frustrating many fans. Right or wrong, good or bad it is a perception that has taken root among many.

There have been some interesting discussions on the message boards about this subject and when you look a little closer you see some things that just jump out at you.

Star-divide

Here is one observation...

The 2009 USC Trojans is probably the least great of the CPC teams since 01 and will most likely lose 1-2 more games before its all said and done.

One over looked reason for this is this is the senior year for the disappointing class of 2006, which was CPC least accomplished in his tenure. The recruiting was excellent, its just the players either didn't live up to expectations or the coaching was too impressed with the * system and mythical recruiting championship as opposed to building the team around chemistry and functionality.

The 2 following classes 07 and 08 have already produced more dividends than the senior class this year.

Of the 06 class, only Taylor Mays is all conference. Stafon Johnson is a solid running back-but many of the other players failed out, transferred or just didn't pan out for whatever reason.

I have every reason to believe that this paradigm has lead to the dip in overall production and performance. The next few years with substantially better and now more mature skill players, we will be back on the top again.

The class of 2006 was a huge recruiting class for USC as they came off the loss to Texas in the BCS Title game. This class was dripping with talent...some real and some imagined. There were also some head-cases in this class as well. These guys were supposed to get us back to the tile game. They were supposed to fill the void left by the greatest offensive production ever seen in college football...Matt/Reggie/LenDale.

It just has never seemed that this class has ever reached its full potential and that is not something that many of us have been used to seeing from Pete Carroll during his tenure at USC...

And here they are.....(taken from Rivals)

Kenny Ashley RB 5-8 210 4.45 5.8 Venice, CA
Walker Ashley DT 6-4 295 4.96 -   Eden Prairie, MN
David Ausberry WR 6-4 213 4.64 6.0 Lemoore, CA
Allen Bradford LB 5-11 219 4.54 6.1 Colton, CA
David Buehler DB   6-2 217 4.5 -   Santa Ana, CA
C.J. Gable ATH 5-11 180 4.6 6.1 Sylmar, CA
Garrett Green QB 6-2 190 4.5 5.7 Sherman Oaks, CA
Stanley Havili RB 6-0 208 4.5 5.8 Salt Lake, UT
Vidal Hazelton WR 6-3 193 4.47 6.1 Chatham, VA
Zack Heberer OL 6-4 269 5.2 5.8 San Pedro, CA
Jamere Holland ATH 6-1 175 4.35 6.0 Woodland Hills, CA
Stafon Johnson RB 5-11 200 4.4 6.1 Los Angeles, CA
Vincent Joseph DB 5-8 165 4.57 5.7 Long Beach, CA
Butch Lewis DT 6-6 280 4.85 6.0 Aurora, CO
Taylor Mays ATH 6-3 218 4.59 6.1 Seattle, WA
Anthony McCoy TE 6-4 240 4.6 5.8 Fresno, CA
Emmanuel Moody RB 6-1 195 4.44 6.0 Coppell, TX
Michael Morgan LB 6-2 200 4.5 6.0 Dallas, TX
Alex Parsons DT 6-4 260 4.9 5.9 Irvine, CA
Travon Patterson WR 5-8 160 4.4 5.7 Long Beach, CA
Antwine Perez DB 6-1 199 4.53 6.0 Camden, NJ
Alfred Rowe DB 6-0 187 4.5 5.6 Long Beach, CA
Derek Simmons DE 6-4 268 5.12 6.0 Fairfield, CA
Joshua Tatum LB 6-0 219 4.66 6.0 Oakland, CA
Gerald Washington TE 6-6 253 4.6 -   Rancho Cucamonga, CA
Shareece Wright DB 5-11 180 4.53 6.0 Colton, CA

As you can see Pete Carroll was able to go after some incredible players...and if you buy into the recruiting rankings there are a lot of stars there!

We also know there was a fair amount of attrition from that class...

K. Ashley
W. Ashley
A. Perez
V. Hazelton
J. Holland
E. Moody
J. Tatum
A. Rowe
V. Joseph
G. Washington

What is left on that original list has either not panned out at all or has not lived up to or come close to their potential.

Obviously, recruiting is a crapshoot...

You can't take what the recruiting services say completely seriously. They get it wrong almost as much as they get it right. The fact is regardless of the amount of stars a player has next to their name that has never shown how hard a player is going to dedicate themselves to improving their game. It doesn't show how hard they are willing to compete. It doesn't show how much of a team player they will be within the program.

Pete Carroll did a great job of selling the benefits of playing at USC to the class of 2006 but it is clear by looking at some on this list that they were either not as talented on the field as advertised or they simply were not prepared to dedicate themselves to the high standards of USC.

I don't have all the answers here. There are some that will say that the coaching staff can't coach players up. Others will say that the coaching staff turnover is to blame and then there are those that will say that Pete Carroll plays favorites or that he got greedy when he took all those running backs.

Who knows...

Others are a lot smarter than I am when it comes to studying and evaluating the individual talents and attributes of the players Pete Carroll recruits. I offer this up simply because it has been a topic of conversation elsewhere and I do think that it is an interesting topic. It is relevant...many continue to point to the loss of Norm Chow as the main reason that SC didn't hang a few more MNC pelts on their wall. Others will talk about the losses of Davis or Coach O. I think those are valid questions but other than Chow all of PC's former assistants went on to blaze their own trail, chase their own dreams of running their own show or trying their hand in the NFL. A successful program will have a lot of attrition of assistants and this has happened to SC.

There is no magic bullet when recruiting top talent. There are always some players who don't pan out or who don't live up to expectations.

Unfortunately the Class of 2006 has a higher than normal amount of disappointment. Real or imagined.

Every player has a different reason for picking the the program they choose. I certainly won't question it. And even though the class of 2006 was for the most part pretty much able to get along that has not necessarily meant success on the field.

Pete Carroll's methods and results are fair game...but I won't lie, while it hasn't always been pretty I am pretty happy with the overall result.

Think of the alternative...

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How did this Class not pan out?

I see 11 current or former starters in this class, for a 7-2 team that has a very good shot at going 11-2, with a true frosh QB at the helm and an overmatched QB coach calling the plays.

I can think of at least 100 other programs who would trade their class of 06 for SC’s 06 Class staright-up, including 9 other programs in the Pac 10.

I think the perception is that this is a disappointing class is because of the more spectacular flameouts of Hazelton, Holland, Moody and Tatum.

Maybe it’s a slow day, Paragon, but I am a bit disappointed that you are using an argument from one of the more active and ridiculous posters on the free site area of WeAreSC to bolster what is a very specious argument, no offense to you personally.

by Zoulou on Nov 11, 2009 8:17 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I am not surprised by this...
I see 11 current or former starters in this class, for a 7-2 team that has a very good shot at going 11-2, with a true frosh QB at the helm and an overmatched QB coach calling the plays.

The emphasized sentence above is all on PC. If Bates is overmatched then why did he pick him? Because he has Pro-style ties? I am not one to complain about turnover on the staff because successful programs get raided but this was PC’s call. If Bates and Morton are not up to snuff then that is all on PC…after all he picked them.

As for the class…If we are looking at the sum of all the parts I would agree with you. But when looking at the individual players I think it tells a whole other story.

Lets look at the receivers. If we never get Dwill who on this list would you prefer to start. Ausberry? Patterson?

I know, I know IF Hazelton stayed etc……well he didn’t.

How about RB? Can’t blame Stafon for his injury. But what about Gable? At one time he was considered the best all around back, what happened? he didn’t just lose all that talent…So he fumbled the ball a few times…no more than McKnight and McKnight has hardly ever been punished for that.

It was Gables attitude you say?

OK but if I am McKnight I know there is no way PC is going to bench me because I bring a lot more to the table… So if Gable has an attitude does that fall in the head case category?

You are right there were an awful lot of Spectacular flame outs…but many of the sour grapes of these guys pointed to Pete Carroll. Right or wrong good or bad he has been the one constant so that raises an eyebrow.

I am the biggest PC homer around but even I know he is not a God. He makes mistakes in all facets of his job.

Havili, Mays, McCoy, have been solid. Stafon too!

Bradford has finally come around, Morgan has finally got his chance which was through no fault of his own. He was not going displace any one of the big 3.

Wright had his chance but pissed it away with being injured and then being ineligible (his legal issues didn’t help his cause after PC told the team to use your head during the bye week). I actually think his lack of effort in the class room is the single biggest reason that the defense has struggled. Pinkard is not a cover corner, Mays is being asked to do too much when he is 25 yards off the ball. Wright being in there changes the dynamic of the whole secondary.

As for the linemen, they have all been serviceable but here hasn’t been a single one that stood out like an O’Dowd, Baker, Byers or Kalil etc.

Again, a nice group when taken as a whole. But there are some deficiencies when looking at the individual parts.

Finally, where I got the inspiration from or whom I got it from is immaterial. I peruse all the different sites and boards for ideas or opinions. I don’t agree with all of them but I also think think that some are thought provoking. I do think this something legit to look at but I noted that it was an observation…I offered no solid evidence as to why. I pointed no fingers it was mere an observation on my part. BTW this observation has been made by more than a few posters on WeAreSC. It isn’t just one guy regardless of his post count.

You think its specious…that’s fine. What else are you selling?

I thought it was worth commenting on.

by Paragon SC on Nov 12, 2009 5:07 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The High Priest has spoken, he hovers above all, he’s “not a fan” just an “interested observer” -because of his girlfriend. It’s classic Desmo Douchebaggery, the guy just can’t resist.

¡Fusílenlo, después veriguamos! - Pancho Villa

by Locoweed 1.1 on Nov 12, 2009 5:24 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Pete aimed for the Stars

Instead of aiming for future great Trojans.

Paragon you nailed this:

The fact is regardless of the amount of stars a player has next to their name that has never shown how hard a player is going to dedicate themselves to improving their game. It doesn’t show how hard they are willing to compete. It doesn’t show how much of a team player they will be within the program.

Paragon above defines a true Trojan football player. Example: Clay Matthews. How many stars did he have next to his name?

In the aftermath of the Texas loss, maybe PC succumbed to the Stars next to recruit’s name, maybe to make himself and SC shine with a quick fix. Maybe he focused on a highly ranked recruiting class and didn’t spend the usual time with detailed evaluation of each recruit’s Trojan potential. That’s just speculation, but I think it is possible and maybe likely.

by uscdude on Nov 12, 2009 7:52 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Bates

Doesn’t get the college game, is too wedded to the pro-style, and seems like a Pete Carroll yes-man. As I’ve said too many times the past 2 weeks, USC needs to introduce elements of the Spread offense. We need PC to proactively evolve the offense, and we need an OC who can implement the Spread and who will make the best decisions for the team, not just say yes to PC.

Give Bates another year and see if he and PC evolve. Because the pro-style is on the way out in college. Matt Barkley will be the last of the Heisman-winning USC pro-style QBs. Scroggins will need to use the Spread – I’m telling you if he doesn’t, the future won’t be so bright.

by uscdude on Nov 12, 2009 7:56 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

I can’t imagine him getting any job offers at this stage. Maybe his buddy Jay Cutler can get him a gig in Chicago after Lovie get the boot.

¡Fusílenlo, después veriguamos! - Pancho Villa

by Locoweed 1.1 on Nov 12, 2009 5:26 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree and disagree with you

I don’t think the Pro Style is on the way out but I think the problem is that PC is wedded to a 10 year old version of the Pro Style that IS out of vogue. I don’t think we necessarily have to go spread wacky to compete but there are better ways that we can utilize our talent.

One thing I do think we need to do is find someone PC trusts enough to let call plays with PC’s interference. I don’t think PC is a good offensive play caller and he’s been so vanilla and predictable in calling plays since NC left (and yes I think PC called plays over Lane, Sark and now Bates) that no one who has seen us before is all that surprised. Our conference foes are so familiar with what we’re going to do it’s disgusting.

[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]

by bluemax on Nov 12, 2009 12:42 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

FWIW, the Chow offense is out of date too. Worse is, his system was too complicated for JDB (our own Wonderlic wonder) so Sarkiffian had to dumb it down, permanently. Now it’s gone and we’re left with PC as our offensive coordinator and Bates/Morton doing his laundry.

¡Fusílenlo, después veriguamos! - Pancho Villa

by Locoweed 1.1 on Nov 12, 2009 5:30 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Think Sarkiffin dumbed it down, or...

PC made them throw out the remaining Chow plays after Leinart graduated? I read recently that Leinart actually had to ask PC to keep in the Chow short passing game in 2005, as PC attempted to discard of the final Chow remnants then. I also read that Chow’s BYU offense was very simple for the players to use.

Loco, I’m really interested to see the Zona game and evaluate their passing spread. I would assume that it is a derivative of the OU offense, which has been the best offense of the decade, I think. We had the best offensive season in 2005, but OU has had more dominant offenses year in and year out. Of course, they too are struggling with a frosh QB at the helm.

by DFWTrojan on Nov 12, 2009 10:06 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

There’s a lot of ground to cover before we get there (heck, even the bRuin defense looks daunting now); but yes, the Zona spread can potentially shred us, especially now that everyone has demonstrated to them exactly how to get it done. Man-up and keep it close or they’re gonna toast us.

¡Fusílenlo, después veriguamos! - Pancho Villa

by Locoweed 1.1 on Nov 12, 2009 11:39 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Pardon me for referencing my own post, but the drop-off in offensive yardage after Leinart left was dramatic. I wonder though if Booty would have been able to run Chow-like schemes with the same degree of effectiveness as Leinart.

by DC Trojan on Nov 13, 2009 8:45 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Well DC, you pretty much sum it up in one paragraph. Booty is several dozen bricks short of a full load upstairs, so it took him forever to get the offense. Add smaller stature (remember all those batted down passes?) and a weaker arm than Leinart to the mix and you end up getting cut by Vikings, then end up on the Titans’ practice squad as a mercy hire.

¡Fusílenlo, después veriguamos! - Pancho Villa

by Locoweed 1.1 on Nov 13, 2009 9:03 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm pretty sure Art of Troy over at Trojan Football Analysis

concluded that Booty didn’t have any more knocked down passes than Palmer or Leinart. The knock downs came at worse times but they didn’t happen at a higher rate than the two QBs before him.

[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]

by bluemax on Nov 13, 2009 12:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Not as good as Leinart, but....

I think the Chow West Coast passing game would have fit Booty much better. Think of all the shorter BYU QBs that have lit it up under Chow. I believe that PC’s pro-style offense puts too much pressure on the QB for reads, audibles, and difficult throws. Norm Chow himself has stated that his system is very easy to learn, and the QBs and WRs have the basics down with/in one week.

Also, I think that JDB had the tools to be an excellent college QB. Stats-wise he was. I think he would have lit it up under Chow. Have you guys noticed that we can now only have a good offense when we have a top 10 draft pick running it? Yet, other offenses are explosive with much less talent? Our offense puts too much pressure on the QB, IMO.

by DFWTrojan on Nov 13, 2009 9:48 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I think it all came down to the unknown fact that Booty tended to under pressure to calling plays in Cajun.

Thus Chow and his native Tun-gun everyone confuse and blinded by the light, players and coaches in mass hysteria cats and dogs living together.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRtAJy2nFVM

Please don't tell me what to do or think, what I might say is a personal opinion.

by so.cal.native1952 on Nov 13, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

USC DUDE

Check out JAG’s Response on the Norm chow thread from a couple of weeks back. It’s spot on and maybe the best ANYONE has ever submitted!!!

by nwtrucker on Nov 12, 2009 1:55 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks NW but I can’t find the response from JAG. Can you copy it? Thanks.

by uscdude on Nov 12, 2009 9:35 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Great Post

And it made me throw up in my mouth as a Big Ten guy seeing all those stars. Jesus.

The Rivalry, Esq.
"Ricky Stanzi is to interceptions as Journey is to 80s rock ballads...inextricably linked."

by grahamfiller10 on Nov 12, 2009 9:21 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

It's sad that an over rated/under coached talent like Taylor Mays

is really the best thing we have from that class.

[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]

by bluemax on Nov 12, 2009 12:43 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Great Class

Yeah, I think this theory is bunk. This was a great class of players. The following players are all-conference ability, starter-level studs: Bradford, Gable, Havili, Hazelton, Johnson, Buehler, Lewis, Mays, McCory, Moody, Morgan, and Wright. Then, we have some excellent, average starter or good back-up, great team player types: Heberer, Green, Parsons, Patterson, Ausberry, and Simmons.

There was substantial turnover, but I’m not sure there is any more turnover than average. I would speculate that 1/3 of recruits each year don’t finish with the program, 1/3 never play significantly, and 1/3 really contribute. I would say this class fits that profile.

My deduction is that PC got too cocky after 2004/2005. He got rid of Norm, changed the schemes, over-recruited some positions, and was too quick to push players out (Hazelton). PC grasped for too much control, and the coaching is the reason for underperformance, not the players. Of course, I also love PC and wouldn’t change much. Just require him to hire an experienced OC.

by DFWTrojan on Nov 12, 2009 1:45 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

THe biggest problem with this class is that coaching positions and responsibilities changed every year.

Yah great rated class by a bunch of Columnists and so-called scouts, but that was HS football. This is college FB and no matter what someone does in HS, if they don’t get further coaching and development no gain. Also how many of these kids have the balls to push themselves in off season (Aaron Corp not) 2 hrs a day of coaching is sometimes not enough. Why you ask because there is 80+ players, it’s like comparing private tennis lessons to group.
But all in all a 7-2 record (8-1 if Bark plays at Wash.) at this juncture isn’t bad considering away games and injuries. I hope this team finds its leader and finishes strong, but if they don’t I will not stop being a fan.

Please don't tell me what to do or think, what I might say is a personal opinion.

by so.cal.native1952 on Nov 12, 2009 3:13 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Never stop supporting our Trojans!

I’m with you So Cal. We may criticize them but they are our team! Fight on!

by uscdude on Nov 12, 2009 9:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

As a Cal fan I must say “lolwut?”

"We lose to Stanford in many sports, but if you want to make a Cal team quit, bring a weapon."
--Coach Clark

by carp on Nov 13, 2009 7:50 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

You’re right. A lot of those players are just totally undertalented/undercoached/underachieving etc. Tell you what, you just throw some of em up to Berkeley and we’ll take em off your hands. Deal? Aright cool.

The Lack of Mack's Imposition Attacks My Disposition.

by Spazzy Mcgee on Nov 13, 2009 10:33 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Dude you guys have better players than over half the Pac-10

Unfortunately you have missed on a couple of kids like Stan Hasiek (which if that dude would have went to Cal would have gotten better coaching) don’t worry your team will turn it around.

Please don't tell me what to do or think, what I might say is a personal opinion.

by so.cal.native1952 on Nov 13, 2009 11:19 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I disagree

Stan Hasiak is getting better coaching under Bob Palcic than he would be getting at Cal. You’d have a good argument if Jim Michalczik was still the O-Line coach at Cal. Unfortunately for Cal and Michalczik he’s coaching the Raiders O-line. Bob Palcic is one of the most accomplished Line coaches in the Pac-10 and he’s done an amazing job of developing the little talent he inherited at UCLA.

by King J77 on Nov 13, 2009 3:49 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

WRONG---i don't care about Cheese Man it's the head coach that I am talking about!

The Weasel couldn’t hold a fart to Tedford and Jeff is way cleaner than that Shark you have over there.

Please don't tell me what to do or think, what I might say is a personal opinion.

by so.cal.native1952 on Nov 13, 2009 4:27 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

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