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Pac 10 v SEC: Some more facts

So we out here in the west know how talented the Pac 10 is, but very rarely do we get the respect we deserve. Bruce Feldman wrote an article today on his blog and he had some interesting stuff about the Pac 10 vs the SEC. Check it out:

 

• More grist for the SEC nonconference scheduling debate. This time from Jon Solomon:

"Besides losing a payday, leaving home means this harsh reality for the SEC: It's pretty mediocre on the road. Since 1998, the SEC is 40-39 in nonconference road games. That mark drops to 24-31 at schools from BCS conferences. The Pac-10, which SEC fans conveniently shoo aside, is now 10-6 this decade against the SEC. Whereas the SEC is 1-6 at Pac-10 schools, the Pac-10 has gone 4-5 at SEC stadiums."

As I said the other day, I do believe that the SEC is the toughest conference in college football. "Believe" being the operative word. And while it is true that the league has won the past two BCS titles, these head-to-head games should carry some weight.

The Heisman Pundit weighed in on this subject recently and raised a valid point.

 

Its all your fault SC. The Pac 10 is just USC and friends according to the other 6 BCS conferences. I hope you at least can admit that there are 6 quality teams in this league, 2 decent ones, and 2 hopeless ones this year.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Conquest Chronicles' writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Conquest Chronicles' writers or editors.

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I'd be interested to see that broken down . . .

. . . on a team-by-team and conference-by-conference basis.

If the S.E.C. is 40-39 in out-of-conference road games and 24-31 in out-of-conference road games against B.C.S. conference teams, that means the league is 16-8 in out-of-conference road games against non-B.C.S. conferences. Offhand, I can’t think of any major S.E.C. teams going on the road to face any non-B.C.S. teams; my guess is, it’s the Mississippis (recurring home-and-homes with Memphis), Mississippi States (just lost to Louisiana Tech at Ruston), and Arkansi of the league playing those games.

A fair number of the road games against B.C.S. conference teams, though, are rivalry games. While, lately, Georgia hasn’t lost much to Georgia Tech and Florida hasn’t lost much to Florida State, there have been plenty of losses by Kentucky at Louisville and South Carolina at Clemson . . . in other words, middle-tier (formerly lower-tier) S.E.C. teams traveling to what typically have been upper-tier A.C.C. and Big East teams. There also are some losses by lower-tier S.E.C. teams traveling to upper-tier teams in their respective leagues: Mississippi State at West Virginia, Vanderbilt at Michigan, Ole Miss at Wake Forest.

In other words, some—-though not all—-of those numbers are misleading, because they don’t represent strength on strength. Relying on those outcomes would be like relying on the scores of recent games pitting Arizona against Louisiana State in Baton Rouge and Washington State against Auburn on the Plains. There, you have lower-tier Pac-10 teams taking on upper-tier S.E.C. teams, producing equally unrepresentative results.

That’s not to say there aren’t lessons to be learned in those figures. Southern California’s season-opening win over Auburn in Los Angeles in 2002 came against a Tiger club that won nine of its next 12 games and capped off the season with a Capital One Bowl victory. Although the Trojans’ 70-17 home win over Arkansas in 2005 came against a Razorback team that went 4-7 overall and 2-6 in the S.E.C., U.S.C. claimed a 50-14 victory over the Hogs in the Natural State in 2006, when Arkansas won ten games, won the Western Division, seriously challenged eventual national champion Florida in the S.E.C. championship game, and attended the Capital One Bowl. Several of the Pac-10’s wins (particularly at home) have been triumphs by good Pac-10 teams over bad S.E.C. teams . . . but a number of them haven’t been, and there is no explaining them away. Any yahoos who question the Pac-10’s toughness or legitimacy are out to lunch; please accept my assurances that they are a vocal minority whom we try to keep in check.

In that respect, as a Southeastern Conference fan, I enjoy and appreciate the value of regional differences in college football. Some folks carp and complain that some leagues have conference title games and others don’t; I like that the Big 12 and the S.E.C. have divisional play while the Pac-10 plays a true round-robin. (By either method, the conference champion will have negotiated a grueling nine-game league slate, thereby accomplishing something respectable.)

Historically, I have not been a fan of Heismanpundit (I cannot say whether that still holds true; after a lengthy back-and-forth in a comment thread at the now-defunct M Zone in early 2006, I stopped reading his site, so my only information about what he has written in the last two and a half years comes from citations appearing at other weblogs), but the above quotation from him is correct. Anyone who thinks of the Pac-10 as “Southern California and the nine dwarves” isn’t paying attention.

For the record, some of us in the Southeast pay attention to events on the Pacific Coast, as Western teams fared quite well on my BlogPoll ballot this week: U.S.C. moved up one spot to No. 1, Oregon moved up one spot to No. 11, Arizona State held steady at No. 14, Cal held steady at No. 17, Boise State held steady at No. 18, U.C.L.A. entered the rankings at No. 19, Utah entered the rankings at No. 20, Fresno State moved up one spot to No. 22, and B.Y.U. is bordering on being admitted to my top 25.

Meanwhile, although some S.E.C. teams moved up on my ballot, Georgia dropped two spots to No. 3, Auburn dropped three spots to No. 10, and Tennessee (along with three other Southern teams) was booted from the top 25 altogether. Yes, I’m a conference and regional homer, but that doesn’t make me impervious to evidence.

I hope we get to continue this conversation in Miami on January 8.

Go 'Dawgs!

by T Kyle King on Sep 4, 2008 5:43 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

About midway through reading this post...

I was thinking to myself… “this has to by Kyle”.

peers down

Yep. ;)

That said, I echo Kyle’s sentiments. A lot of the SEC knows that the Pac-10 plays some solid football; I think if you asked most SEC partisans what the top two conferences in the country are, you’d have a pretty good chance they’d name the SEC….and then the Pac-10.

by CAJason80 on Sep 4, 2008 9:08 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No they wouldn't!

I’d say at least 75% of the time, an SEC guy/gal goes for the Big 12 as their “next” best/toughest conference. Hell, most SEC guys/gals go for the Big 10 as their 3rd choice.

Face it guys, y’all in SEC land have got “this complex” as it applies to the PAC 10. Y’all really do.

"Surround yourself with people who can't live without football" - 1st tenet of 3 for Bear Bryant's 3 Rules of Coaching . . . . .

by BixBeiderbecke on Sep 5, 2008 12:58 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This...

…SEC guys sees the SEC as #1 and the Pac-10 as #2. Nobody else is even close.

by Nico2.0 on Sep 6, 2008 1:43 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well

Most SEC guys aren’t NIco 2.0. (guys here at Conquest Chronicles- Nico is not only THE administrator over at Roll Bama Roll, but he’s also my broheem!) And if I might clarify, I don’t feel the whole entire fanbase of the SEC sees the PAC 10 as “a complex”, but when it comes to “homers”- there’s nothing but disdain and disrespect for our brand of sport and football.

Hey Neek, aren’t you supposed to be at a wedding today? (I knew you couldn’t keep away from football. ON A SATURDAY!)

"Surround yourself with people who can't live without football" - 1st tenet of 3 for Bear Bryant's 3 Rules of Coaching . . . . .

by BixBeiderbecke on Sep 6, 2008 3:48 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wedding didn't start 'til 6pm Central...

…so I got to take in plenty of football before the nuptials kicked off. It was an outdoor wedding at someone’s residence. The funny part was right after the couple said their “I Do’s” you heard someone a few houses down scream “ROLL TIDE ROLL!” I thought they were eavesdropping on the wedding, but I looked at my watch and it was exactly kickoff time. :D

by Nico2.0 on Sep 7, 2008 10:32 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What an excellent way to. . .

. . . .to wrap up the nuptials! (how hard was it for you to NOT get over to a tv? if you didn’t mosey over to someones tv, the food and drank over at reception must have been TOP NOTCH!)

Roll Tide! (indeed)

"Surround yourself with people who can't live without football" - 1st tenet of 3 for Bear Bryant's 3 Rules of Coaching . . . . .

by BixBeiderbecke on Sep 8, 2008 7:08 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well...

…my brother was sending text message updates and another guy at the reception had one of those one earbud radios, so we were pretty well-informed. And yes, the food at the reception was really good. The bride is a chef and she made most of the food and the beer was home-brewed by another friend of ours. It was pretty awesome.

by Nico2.0 on Sep 8, 2008 11:03 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The MUSIC!

But. . . . .broheem! How was the music? Did you get down wit ya bad self? (then get back up again!)

"Surround yourself with people who can't live without football" - 1st tenet of 3 for Bear Bryant's 3 Rules of Coaching . . . . .

by BixBeiderbecke on Sep 8, 2008 12:25 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The music...

…was awesome. It was just recorded music, but my friend has great tastes. I remember hearing The Fall, Devo, Hank Williams Sr., Rolling Stones, etc.

by Nico2.0 on Sep 8, 2008 12:46 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Gettin' that drank on, . . .

. . .eatin’ some good grub,. . . gettin’ them text messages, . . . .boogie-in’ here and there, . . . . .THINGS WERE lookin’ good on Saturday !!!!! Alright, alright.

"Surround yourself with people who can't live without football" - 1st tenet of 3 for Bear Bryant's 3 Rules of Coaching . . . . .

by BixBeiderbecke on Sep 8, 2008 1:44 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Another interesting stat

If you take USC out the Pac 10 is 6-6 v the SEC
If you take LSU out the SEC is 1-7 v the Pac 10

Remember that you are correct in saying that we might have played lower tier SEC teams, LSU played Arizona twice (or three times?) and Auburn played Washington State, not exactly powerhouses

And a few years ago remember how close LSU was to losing to Oregon State

by The VD Special on Sep 5, 2008 10:27 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I hope

that we aren’t going to hear a lecture on how Vandy is now a powerhouse because of their recent upset of the Gamecocks.

by frak on Sep 5, 2008 9:05 AM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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